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 Zoey? or Aphrodite?

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WazzuMan
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PostSubject: Re: Zoey? or Aphrodite?   Fri Feb 04, 2011 9:16 am

It's not like she's an expert or anything, she was being stupid, up in her fantasies. I still think she needs a long lesson about guys, probably from Aphrodite since she lives in reality.
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PostSubject: Re: Zoey? or Aphrodite?   Sat Feb 12, 2011 7:05 pm

Zoey she's got alot on her has made mistakes but she's doing better. She lead's from her heart like her Grandma taught her so she's real. (A) is to harsh even though she can be kind it's two little and the only reason she sticks with the one guy is because only one guy wants her. Just saying.... cheers
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PostSubject: Re: Zoey? or Aphrodite?   Tue Mar 22, 2011 1:35 am

i havnt been able to understand Zoeys judgment with boys. i mean she say she not want boys then she get them all again!

i guess i choose aphrodite cuz she got Tude with a capital A lolz
and knows how to deal with dangerous situations with a cool head:)




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PostSubject: Re: Zoey? or Aphrodite?   Wed Mar 23, 2011 2:26 pm

I"m starting to likr Aphrodite more...Zoey is just...I dunno...
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PostSubject: Re: Zoey? or Aphrodite?   Sat Mar 26, 2011 8:56 pm

I love them both, they are the perfect opposites of each other and keep each other balanced. One without the other and the world falls apart. Smile
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PostSubject: Re: Zoey? or Aphrodite?   Sun Mar 27, 2011 1:54 pm

Aphrodite FTW! She's my favorite character in HoN.
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PostSubject: Re: Zoey? or Aphrodite?   Wed May 25, 2011 2:37 pm

Aphrodite is more fun to read about, not to mention that she is one of my fave characters for her intelligence and good attitude. Don't have a problem with Zoey, though.
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PostSubject: Re: Zoey? or Aphrodite?   Fri May 27, 2011 11:37 am

Too me I dont have any harsh veiws. i Love them both. Aphrodite was a ho in the beginning...hallway with Erik YUCK but shes awesome, and Zoey is a non-cussier like me and she may be turning into a ho but I dont believe she means to. Theres my answer. Thnak you and good morning/night.
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PostSubject: Re: Zoey? or Aphrodite?   Fri May 27, 2011 11:56 am

I prefer Aphrodite. she is wayyyy more chillaxed and down to earth than Zoey.
She's not afraid to be herself and is a great girl
She defrosts after knowing Zoey for a while, which makes her a better person
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PostSubject: Re: Zoey? or Aphrodite?   Wed Apr 18, 2012 9:54 pm

aphrodite, funny as hell.
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PostSubject: Re: Zoey? or Aphrodite?   Wed Jul 16, 2014 11:21 am

Aphrodite was more liekable than Zoey starting in book one.
Yes, she is bitchy, she is elitist and completely obsessed with her ex-boyfriend.
BUT, Zoey is badmouthing someone or some group in almost every sentence, while always nice on the outside.
The two of them are Severus Snape and Dolores Jane Umbridge from Harry Potter if those two were schoolgirls. One a jerk and the other outwardly sweet but far more horrible inside.

Some examples earlier in the series:
Elliot is a homophob and rude, but Zoey always insults him for being ugly.
Zoey always insults Aphrodites dresses, but nonchalantly puts one of them on.
Zoey believes she would make a better leader for the Daughters than Aprhodite. The next book starts a month or so later and Zoey has not given her new responsibility any thoughts. She does not know which ritual to use or what direction she wants to take the oragnization. She only invests one afternoon in this and chooses a model from a elite school of all things. With her friends in most leader positions. She also blames everything bad about the old Daughters on Aphrodite despite the fact that something like this pseudo-feminism was never expressed by Aphrodite, who in opposition to it actually was obsessed with her ex-boyfriend.

As the series moves on Aphrodite evolves into a genuinely likeable character.
She is less of a *edit your post and this will go away* and even during her worst times she was not half as bad and a lot more sophisticated than the twins pre-splitup.
She really does not appear like a *edit your post and this will go away* at all. Just a self-confident character who thinks for herself.
She obviously has the better relationship after getting over Erik. 1) It is only one guy(only one guy at a time being the important part), 2)The guy in question is not a jerk, not a creep and not a psychopath(because Zoeys lover are all in atleast on of these categories).
She also supports other people.

Zoey on the other hand becomes even less likeable.
She outright kills two men, who never went further than verbal harassment. They might have survived she tells us, but she does not even check up on that. The next scene Loren is more important than the two men she atleast almost killed.

She permanently calls Aphrodite a ho and tells her to her face how Darius is to good for her and she should break up with him. A chapter or so earlier Aphrodite stood up for her in a situation with Heath!

And Zoey has multiple boyfriends herself. She actually complaints how difficult it is to juggle three guys! Can you imagine a male character complaining how it is difficult to have three girlfriends at a time and keep them hidden from each other and consider him likeable?

Plus, as mentioned earlier, Zoey always chooses horrible people. If presented with a drunk who uses an addiction of yours to seduce you, a teacher who is stalking you and a Jerk, you do not choose all three of them, you choose not one of them, you choose option 4: look for someone decent. And don't get me started on her later suitors...

(Oh, and my problem is not the sheer number of guys, if she broke up with one before dating the next and broke up with that new one before coming back to her old love I would be a lot less irritated.
Nor is the problem that it happened. If she had three boyfriends at a time at one point and she had realized how stupid she had been it would be fine, because a character is allowed to make mistakes, but Zoey just does not learn!)

She is also still judgemental of things and chooses to do things she was judgemental about before herself without ever realizing that she might have been wrong earlier. Just think about her giving Erik that blow-job under roughly the same premise as Aphrodite.

Further her definition of leader seems to be: Someone who can do whatever he wants and people have to listen to.
She almost always puts herself first and takes her friends for granted despite the fact that she almost lost them before.

I understand it is easy to feel for Zoey especially in the first books, but that is because she sees herself as the victim and the First-Person-Narration makes that sound like a fact.
Just think about the birthday scene, where she had time to tell her friends way before. Once they call her out for it she throws in her dead friend as her defense.
Or her friends being angry at her for keeping secrets. Instead of explaining it to them she gets pissed at them for not forgiving her already.

Aphrodite started out as a bad person, who became a good person and therefore is far better than Zoey who started out as a bad person and hypocrite, who became a horrible person and hypocrite.
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PostSubject: Re: Zoey? or Aphrodite?   Thu Jul 17, 2014 7:44 am

I think the thing to keep in mind here is that we are talking about a teenager and young adult who live unusually complicated lives and are given many responsibilities they aren't prepared for.

Zoey is in the middle of massive life changes, is coming from an abusive household and a relationship that ended poorly. I haven't read the books recently and I don't know that she throws around so many insults as you suggest. In fact I think it's funny because I don't think Aphrodite has ever had a conversation in the entire series without throwing in an insult. Honestly it sounds like what you're describing is common courtesy: "say something nice or don't say anything at all". They're both young so of course they make all kinds of judgements early on about people they don't know including each other and the difference between them is that one shows more restraint while the other is brutally honest. Umbridge was a women without restraint and she acted cruelly while attempting and failing to hide behind the facade of a caring adult.

Something else though about the earlier books, the author made the creative decision to base the events of the first three around the time of the full moon and therefore gave some pretty weak excuses for why no significant events happened during the intervals between books. Zoey being overburdening with adjusting to a new school to deal with the Dark Daughters, I understand. I don't understand why neither Neferet or her friends ever brought it up or offered assistance in the entire month despite knowing full well Zoey was still readjusting to a whole new life. Or that Zoey spent a whole month searching for her "zombie" best friend and never saw one sign of her or asked Nyx for guidance before the events of Chosen.

As for the rest of it I think I've discussed some of these things at one point or another. The Birthmas presents, for instance, when one neither looks forward to their birthday/Christmas and are consumed with thoughts of her best friend being an undead killer and their mentor being an evil witch, I can understand why it crept up on her without her realising it.

And her many relationships, I have spoken at length about. Though mostly I speak for Zoey and against the other guys because since I've seen a lot of comments that seem to lay all the blame on her or more than I feel she deserves. Personally I think it would have been best if Zoey wasn't in a relationship, that she focused on saving the world first then assuming she survives she has several lifetimes to focus on anything else. Actually, since she is so terrible with guys I suggested more than once that maybe she was "playing with the wrong team".

As to the original question: I choose Aphrodite. Not because she's shown the most growth but for aspects she's had since the series began. She is the most honest and down-to-earth character of the series, has a very realistic view of situations and she doesn't take any nonsense from anyone.
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PostSubject: Re: Zoey? or Aphrodite?   Thu Jul 17, 2014 12:09 pm

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Zoey being overburdening with adjusting to a new school to deal with the Dark Daughters, I understand. I don't understand why neither Neferet or her friends ever brought it up or offered assistance in the entire month despite knowing full well Zoey was still readjusting to a whole new life.
But that is my point about what she believes a leader is. In the first books she decides at one point that she would make a better leader than Aphrodite for the dark daughters with the reasoning that she is simply better than her.
It becomes pretty clear that she is not ready to be a leader. Yet she never accepts or reflects on the fact that she is unfit to be a leader at this point nor actively tries to become a better leader, she just carries it as a prestigious title. It is especially annoying with the dark daughters title, because at the time where she gets it she is pretty much dragged through the plot by the divine hand of Nyx.

Quote :
I haven't read the books recently and I don't know that she throws around so many insults as you suggest. In fact I think it's funny because I don't think Aphrodite has ever had a conversation in the entire series without throwing in an insult. Honestly it sounds like what you're describing is common courtesy: "say something nice or don't say anything at all".

Actually Aphrodite has quite a few, while she is Zoeys sole friend in the world following the Loren debacle and if she insults someone it is mostly witty and directed at a single person.

After Zoey is marked she gives us. Quote from book one:

Quote :
Were there vampyre dorks? How about Barbie-like vampyre cheerleaders? Did any vampyres play in the band? Were there vampyre Emos with their guy-wearing-girl’s-pants weirdness and those awful bangs that cover half their faces? Or were they all those freaky Goth kids who didn’t like to bathe much? Was I going to turn into a Goth kid? Or worse, an Emo?
She insults all vampyres, all goths and all emos and in her world the most well known vampyres are hollywood actors, so why does she associate them with goths and emos in the first place.

Later she says a girl must have lost her mind, because she's got body piercings.

When she gets home she says her brother plays bloody video games the whole day and her sister is a slut that slept with half of the football team.
But given how much she exagerrates in other situations I doubt her sister is more than sexually active and her brother more than a ordinary gamer(a category in which you fall as much as I do judging by your signature).

Then she wonders if she gets a class about tearing peoples throats open or something like that, just to get all protective of vampires once her Stepfather starts talking badly about them.

The good old oral sex scene with Aphrodite and Erik has her tell us how no girl with a functioning brain would ever do that.

And even while putting on eye shadow she insults girls who put on too much eye shadow as loser girls, who look like scary racoons.(Her eye shadow has apparently silver sparkles in it, which is something that can be considered too much as well)
The last example is especially horrible, because she insults other girls so casually and unnecessary for doing something different than herself.
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